I recall there used to be plans for implementing a cell part that would turn ATP into glucose, but I don’t know what happened to them…
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Sadly the game code architecture doesn’t work like that. Sunlight is a value that applies at the same instant to everything in the environment. Radiation wouldn’t so trying to put it into the same system would require code changes everywhere environmental compounds are handled (which is just about everywhere stuff is produced or production is estimated).
Sadly none of our theorists really frequent the forums whatsoever so this info won’t really go anywhere…
I was thinking this and the fact that don’t some materials become radioactive if exposed to strong radiation? At least for a while. So using existing game systems to effectively and quickly program the feature seemed to fit well enough with realism.
Exactly, but someone needs to really want to make the organelle for it to happen. It took the eukaryotic version of rusticyanin like 3 years to get made after the prokaryotic version was added.
Yeah, this is kind of the main issue with the energy source. I tried to balance it show that the energy wouldn’t immediately cut off with the heat gone. But I’m not sure how good I managed to make the balance in terms of how much extra storage would help here.
Well it is internally implemented as a compound. So compound game mechanics apply to it.
There was a draft implementation but it had many drawbacks that needed sorting out. Ultimately the person working on that didn’t finish it so it was never finished.
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Maybe that draft will get it’s chance one day… someday…
Edit: I also recall there might’ve been plans for mucus to somehow become consumable by other organisms and reconvertable into glucose, through these seem to have been abandoned just like the draft…
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They do, it’s induced radioactivity. You mainly see it discussed in the context of creating a nuclear reactor/bomb in the first place. It’s not really relevant IRL regarding the effect of radioactivity on life as far as I am aware. though part of the immediate “damage” done by radiation is technically the same process.
That’s a shame. I am curious though: does that mean the rocks emit an invisible compound cloud, or do you just directly add an amount of the radiation compound per second to every cell within range?
Ah. That is also very unfortunate… Maybe someone can like Deus (Not gonna tag people if I don’t have to) can throw the question at a theorist if he thinks it’s important.
Yeah this is actually what I mentioned before, I am not even sure how this was supposed to have worked IRL. A probably inaccurate “fix” would be to just have it produce ATP while cooling too. But that would kind of ruin the concept I suppose. Adding a long delay to the stop of ATP production would also just make the system more unclear and difficult to understand.
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On a different compound, I noticed that there still seem to be cases of the vents biome getting bloated with H2S due to species apparently not taking interest to adapting (more) to use it despite the concentrations getting above 500.
I also noticed that for whatever reason autoevo thinks THIS species:
Is sustainable in THIS patch:
(Which it almost certainly is not sustainable in, especially as autoevo labels it solely under the iron-eating miche in the food web)
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Huh. Why would Auto-Evo put an organism without any Rusticyanin/Ferroplasts under one of the Iron-eating Niches?
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It’s added directly. There’s a system that gets all the microbes near radioactive rocks and then adds them the radiation compound directly into their storage based on the distance to the chunk and inverse square law.
If you are curious about the exact details, the code is in the IrradiationSystem:
I could further reduce how much “temperature” the ATP generation consumes per second to make the heat up effect last longer (as long as the cell has a good amount of storage). I already introduced a display rounding bug with the change:
So I could lower it further but showing very small numbers in the tooltip would be pretty hard to read and understand for the players, I think.
The species has one ferroplast, so technically it has access to rusticyanin enzyme and thus iron chunks are a valid food source for it. The lysosomes also add bonuses to digestion.
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I’ve generally noticed that autoevo eukaryotic species seem to sometimes think that if they just have a single organelle for a foodsource, they’re fine despite it being absolutely suboptimal in an actual game environment and not it’s approximation made by autoevo. Through I guess the approximation can only be so accurate before it gets too complex…
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I see!
I asked because your previous comment made me wonder whether it would be easier to “directly” add damage and (depending on melanosomes) ATP to cells based on those criteria instead, skipping the “radiation compound”.
But having said that, I now feel like that probably occurred to you, and does not work.
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Well due to how damage works in the game, we can’t apply damage each game update (hud flashing, sound playing, notification messages), instead there needs to be rate limiting. So that would require extra data storage somewhere in the game to be added. With the current approach the damage system can look at how much radiation compound there is in cells and apply damage at a fixed intervals that the system runs at. So that way the damage is applied every now and then like required, and there’s no need to find a place to put another damage cooldown variable.
Our primary microbe components are way too big for a clean ECS design already (this is mostly caused by converting the architecture rather than starting from a clean slate). It was not really possible to split the main microbe components into smaller pieces like they should be as our gameplay logic was written to all the time want to read almost all of the cell data to determine what happens whenever something needs doing. That’s not a good design for an ECS architecture.
Edit: I also considered adding a new component purely for radiation gameplay purposes, but that would break old save compatibility hard. So it would have either required save breakage for all players, or it would require writing a really complicated save upgrader step. This would be the cleanest solution but I prioritised implementation difficulty and letting people continue their old saves.
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By the way, while probably being overdone for the feature already, perhaps radiation damage (or just being irradiated) could make the cells take longer to start regenerating as radiation would (still) be present in their interiors?
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While playing the upgraded save file I had for 0.8.1.0, I noticed a strange damage interaction occurring. I am not sure if this is intended, but even though the osmoregulation cost without movement says I have enough ATP to live, when I actually play, it randomly gives damage to me. Yes. The game randomly does damage to me, even though I have Glucose for making ATP, and do not move. and it does not always occur.
This was the organism I was using when I had the weird damage interaction.
Actually, this was the second time this weird damage interaction occurred. The first time was playing with another organism on the same save, but in a Banana Biome. Since it was slightly lower in pressure than default, I had +10% Osmoregulation cost, -10% bioprocess speed, and -35.1% health. Please see below.
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Were you rotating with the first organism? As that may’ve raised the atp consumption enough to start damaging the cell.
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Nope. I just checked. I kept the cursor on the organism and did not rotate it, and the damage still occurred. Unless the organism is automatically being rotated after dividing at the start of the turn.
Was the damage significant enough that it led to your cell dying?
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For the first cell, yes, but as I stated earlier, it did not occur always consistently. Sometimes, I would go for a few seconds without any damage happening, and then every other second, it would happen again. But then the pattern changes, and I get damage at a different interval, I think.
I hope this isn’t a bug, because this save is the one I am using for my FG.
The second species also being afflicted by the bug seems more conserning as it should have a solid reserve of ATP production. Which might be suggesting that this indeed is a bug and not intended behaviour.
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It occurs despite the fact that I re-load the save file. Let me see if this still occurs after I exit to the main menu and load the save back up. I will also check if this occurs after I exit and start the game again.
Edit: Yup. It occurs when I exited to the main menu, and then reloaded the save file. It also still occurred after I exited the game, restarted the game, and then loaded the save.
I also checked the output logs, and there is nothing about the damage I am receiving while playing.
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It’s not visible in the screenshot but you probably have too low storage. So when the game has slight framerate dips the ATP that fits in your storage at once might not be enough to cover the osmoregulation cost.
Since the first time someone reported this and I investigated a save where you needed to get like over 25 FPS to not take damage, I added this to my TODO list:
add a storage tooltip that also explains too low storage can lead to ATP shortages even if ATP balance is positive
Other than that I’m not sure what should be done, though maybe if ATP usage per second is over the storage amount within a given range, the storage amount could turn red to indicate the problem.
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The weird thing is that my glucose goes up from Photosynthesis, but I still take damage. I just checked right now to be sure.