From what it seems photosynthesis needs 6 CO2s (along with other particles) to create 1 glucose particle, while the primary form of fermentation making the basis of the hydrogenase process releases 2 CO2s from 1 glucose. So the impact should still be noticeable.
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It’s a very easy thing to miss, and I think most people unfortunately do not read these descriptions closely? Also, lots of these enzymes can run in reverse in the right circumstances, so it’s easy to get confused.
Achievements:
I have been able to unlock Yum! and The Editor so far, but at some point this savegame stopped allowing achievements. Any specific triggers for that? I probably hit a cheat key by accident (did not fully disable yet).
Multicellular:
- Not sure if I really directly notice any increased zoom distance, but at least my view never seemed too restricted.
- Growth/reproduction seems perhaps a bit faster? At least when actively gathering P and N. Passive growth still very slow.
- I am very happy to see some connections between cells in multicellular! Makes things look much more like an actual organism! A few things stand out though:
- What’s the idea behind the “single large bridge” aesthetic? Makes things look not yet fully connected compared to a “gel” or many small bridges. As far as I know those other options would also look more true to life.
- It seems to only connect daughter cells to mother cells, instead of all adjacent cells, which looks a bit odd.
- There’s no equivalent for pre-multicellular colonies?
- In transition to macroscopic, conversion to balls still seems a bit scrambled:
No more crashes since I updated my drivers!
Anything more specific to say on what should be tested?
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I suppose a more complex matrix (like one in which all internal would be submerged from all sides) could pose certain problems like perhaps it clipping into chunks and stuff, or creating annoying hitboxes if that was to be implemented (which doesn’t seem to be the case).
Might be becase those colonies can have cells oriented in more complex ways which might mess up the current matrix code.
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It would create a big unbalanced CO2 producer in the game (photosynthesis is balanced by respiration). There would need to be some other factor that would balance the CO2 generated from all the hydrogenase or otherwise all the game worlds would be like 95% CO2. So that’s why it wasn’t added because it would ruin the dynamic gas simulation.
Most likely yes. Since the RC I’ve added a popup text in the bottom right corner that says “Current game is no longer eligible for achievements” the first time a cheat is used. That should make it easy to notice when that happens. And also there was a bug with save loading directly from the main menu making the game think the save had cheats used when it in reality didn’t. That’s also fixed for the 0.8.3 proper.
This graphics approach is like at least 10 times easier than any other alternative. So the reason is the massive difference in effort required between the alternative implementation ways.
It visually represents the cell colony structure. Each cell in a colony is only attached to one parent cell. When the parent cell is removed from a colony all cells attached to it also detach. So the visuals are made to match the actual gameplay impact the structure has.
No, but due to the physics touching requirement pre-multicellular colonies always have the cells touching. Thus this new system would actually not render anything as it skips cells that are directly touching and thus don’t need the bridge graphics.
Well there’s been no change to that algorithm so I would have been more worried if something had changed.
Not really, I think most of the big problems with achievements and other new features have been found already. I have written the full patch notes list already but I’ll hold off on posting that.
It’s just way, way harder to do the math and required code changes to shift the membrane points to appear connected. Though you are right that this approach would also require physics changes so that the adjusted membranes are used for physics calculations to ensure the graphics still match the physics. Like I said above, at least 10 times more difficult.
It was actually fixed for the rotations, but again the code skips too short bridges between cells and thus they would all be just skipped in pre-multicellular colonies (because the colony parent cell a cell attaches to in microbe stage must have been touching as the attach logic is triggered from the physics system, and there can only ever be a single colony parent for each cell).
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Were there tests made with hydrogenase-generated CO2 that gave these numbers?
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No, but I’m confident it would ruin the tweaked balance of the ending oxygen and co2 numbers currently in the game.
If someone is willing to balance the effect, I’m totally fine with adding it but I’m not going to allow anyone to tell me that I need to spend the time doing that balancing after adding the effect.
4 Likes
It just seems strange to me that we’re “abandoning” scientific accuracy here but I suppose that’s the cost of us trying to get the remaining roadmap items done ASAP.
Also, I know this isn’t something added in this rc, but I feel like certain meteorite types are… odd. Like I don’t recall there being meteorites made in large part of glucose for example. Where did that come from?
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I believe all the meteor types were added in 0.8.2.0.; I think there were discussed in the dev forum.
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I saw one post about them but it didn’t give sources on if those “dubious meteor types” actually exist(ed) in real life. Apparently the main discussion was held on discord so 
.
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Would a meteor made entirely of Glucose even survive re-entry? Also, ironically enough, Glucose meteors would probably help solve the idea of microbes surviving in space for Panspermia.
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Don’t know, maybe if it falls down in a specific way?
By the way, I think eukaryotes still have a hard time evolving to be the dominant dominion of life without the player’s aid. We really need those size-based miches…
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Speaking of, I am pretty sure phosphate hasn’t really been observed that much in asteroids. Or uranium.
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Two things:
- I am pretty sure Glucose in Thrive is not just glucose. It represents any and all organic compounds, and I do believe we found those plenty on asteroids.
- Of course no asteroid is entirely made up of glucose. This just means there was an asteroid with enough organic compounds to make a difference. So if that’s true, it’s only the effect size that is exaggerated, which is essentially a lot of Thrive.
Not never though:
And besides, given that any organism can use the “phosphate” in Thrive, you could easily argue it also represents proteins and amino acids.
Which reminds me for whatever reason, on fermentation not producing CO2 (and the potential unbalancing as a result for adding it):
The only real sources of glucose production in the game I am aware of are photosynthesis and chemosynthesis, both of which consume CO2. So in theory, fermentation not producing CO2 is itself unbalancing, but the current system must be tuned to compensate,
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The thing is that we would then need to “retune” the system to that it now uses hydrogenase co2 for balance instead of co2 from stuff like meteors or eruptions.
Edit: Got a crash when switching to multicellular, might be the same as the previous one I’ve experienced.
Summary
Disbanding colony and becoming multicellular
Game is in now in prototypes. EXPECT MAJOR BUGS!
Moving species Primum thrivium (1) from MicrobeSpecies to MulticellularSpecies
Canceling and restarting auto-evo to have stage changed species versions in it
Switching to multicellular editor
ERROR: Cannot get class ‘’.
ERROR: at: _instantiate_internal (core/object/class_db.cpp:549)
ERROR: WARNING: Node of type cannot be created. A placeholder will be created instead.
ERROR: at: instantiate (scene/resources/packed_scene.cpp:276)
ERROR: Cannot get class ‘’.
ERROR: at: _instantiate_internal (core/object/class_db.cpp:549)
ERROR: WARNING: Node of type cannot be created. A placeholder will be created instead.
ERROR: at: instantiate (scene/resources/packed_scene.cpp:276)
ERROR: Cannot get class ‘’.
ERROR: at: _instantiate_internal (core/object/class_db.cpp:549)
ERROR: WARNING: Node of type cannot be created. A placeholder will be created instead.
ERROR: at: instantiate (scene/resources/packed_scene.cpp:276)
ERROR: Cannot get class ‘’.
ERROR: at: _instantiate_internal (core/object/class_db.cpp:549)
ERROR: WARNING: Node of type cannot be created. A placeholder will be created instead.
ERROR: at: instantiate (scene/resources/packed_scene.cpp:276)
ERROR: Cannot get class ‘’.
ERROR: at: _instantiate_internal (core/object/class_db.cpp:549)
ERROR: WARNING: Node of type cannot be created. A placeholder will be created instead.
ERROR: at: instantiate (scene/resources/packed_scene.cpp:276)
ERROR: Fatal error. 0xC0000005
ERROR: at Godot.NativeCalls.godot_icall_1_323(IntPtr, IntPtr, Int32)
ERROR: at Thriveopedia.AddPage(System.String, IThriveopediaPage)
ERROR: at Thriveopedia.set_CurrentGame(GameProperties)
ERROR: at PauseMenu.set_GameProperties(GameProperties)
ERROR: at EditorBase2[[System.__Canon, System.Private.CoreLib, Version=9.0.0.0, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=7cec85d7bea7798e],[System.__Canon, System.Private.CoreLib, Version=9.0.0.0, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=7cec85d7bea7798e]].InitEditor(Boolean) ERROR: at MulticellularEditor.InitEditor(Boolean) ERROR: at EditorBase2[[System.__Canon, System.Private.CoreLib, Version=9.0.0.0, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=7cec85d7bea7798e],[System.__Canon, System.Private.CoreLib, Version=9.0.0.0, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=7cec85d7bea7798e]].OnEnterEditor()
ERROR: at MulticellularEditor.OnEnterEditor()
ERROR: at EditorBase2[[System.__Canon, System.Private.CoreLib, Version=9.0.0.0, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=7cec85d7bea7798e],[System.__Canon, System.Private.CoreLib, Version=9.0.0.0, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=7cec85d7bea7798e]]._Ready() ERROR: at Godot.Node.InvokeGodotClassMethod(Godot.NativeInterop.godot_string_name ByRef, Godot.NativeInterop.NativeVariantPtrArgs, Godot.NativeInterop.godot_variant ByRef) ERROR: at EditorBase2[[System.__Canon, System.Private.CoreLib, Version=9.0.0.0, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=7cec85d7bea7798e],[System.__Canon, System.Private.CoreLib, Version=9.0.0.0, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=7cec85d7bea7798e]].InvokeGodotClassMethod(Godot.NativeInterop.godot_string_name ByRef, Godot.NativeInterop.NativeVariantPtrArgs, Godot.NativeInterop.godot_variant ByRef)
ERROR: at MulticellularEditor.InvokeGodotClassMethod(Godot.NativeInterop.godot_string_name ByRef, Godot.NativeInterop.NativeVariantPtrArgs, Godot.NativeInterop.godot_variant ByRef)
ERROR: at Godot.Bridge.CSharpInstanceBridge.Call(IntPtr, Godot.NativeInterop.godot_string_name*, Godot.NativeInterop.godot_variant**, Int32, Godot.NativeInterop.godot_variant_call_error*, Godot.NativeInterop.godot_variant*)
ERROR: at Godot.NativeCalls.godot_icall_3_828(IntPtr, IntPtr, IntPtr, Godot.NativeInterop.godot_bool, Int32)
ERROR: at Godot.Node.AddChild(Godot.Node, Boolean, InternalMode)
ERROR: at SceneManager.SwitchToScene(Godot.Node, Boolean)
ERROR: at MicrobeStage.MoveToMulticellular()
ERROR: at TransitionManager+Sequence.StartNext()
ERROR: at TransitionManager+Sequence.Process()
ERROR: at TransitionManager._Process(Double)
ERROR: at Godot.Node.InvokeGodotClassMethod(Godot.NativeInterop.godot_string_name ByRef, Godot.NativeInterop.NativeVariantPtrArgs, Godot.NativeInterop.godot_variant ByRef)
ERROR: at Godot.Control.InvokeGodotClassMethod(Godot.NativeInterop.godot_string_name ByRef, Godot.NativeInterop.NativeVariantPtrArgs, Godot.NativeInterop.godot_variant ByRef)
ERROR: at TransitionManager.InvokeGodotClassMethod(Godot.NativeInterop.godot_string_name ByRef, Godot.NativeInterop.NativeVariantPtrArgs, Godot.NativeInterop.godot_variant ByRef)
ERROR: at Godot.Bridge.CSharpInstanceBridge.Call(IntPtr, Godot.NativeInterop.godot_string_name*, Godot.NativeInterop.godot_variant**, Int32, Godot.NativeInterop.godot_variant_call_error*, Godot.NativeInterop.godot_variant*)
Child process exited with code -1073741819
Thrive exited abnormally with an error
Output is too long, it was truncated! See the Thrive log file for full output.
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